Frasier 2x01-05
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tori_reviewsFrasier 2x01: Slow Tango in South Seattle
When I was skipping through eps a few weeks ago I watched part of this one, but I don't remember having seen it before that. But this time it definitely stuck in my head, and I was a little trepidatious about actually watching it considering the subject matter.
Truthfully I'm not as hard line as some people about age of consent, in the sense that I tend to think 18 is a little high and still an arbitrary line in the sand that doesn't fit for everyone. So 17 shouldn't necessarily bug me, and considering this would have happened in the late 60s I definitely don't think people were as stuck on 18 as the defining line for such things. I think what bugs me it that the show never even raises the question of if Frasier feels it was acceptable now that he's the older man. Just a few episodes ago we saw him struggle with whether it was appropriate for him to date a 22 year old and that relationship was not presented with any power disparity as a teacher and student could have.
Certainly when he talks about his relationship with Clarice it is with fondness and the romanticism of first love and the past, but when he's uneasy about the book no one even brings up that maybe he isn't completely okay with what happened and is now seeing it through a different light as an adult. It would certainly seem possible to me that, even if he is okay with everything that happened, he might feel uneasy about people knowing about it because it's not going to look good from the outside. And that's why having the episode go to/Niles jumping on the idea that it's about how things ended without ever considering issues with the rest of what happened doesn't feel right to me.
Not that the episode can seem to decide how okay Frasier is with people knowing this is his story. He's angry about not being thanked but then tells Roz not to spread the truth around. Sometimes he seems upset that the story in told in confidence has been used without his consent but sometimes he just seems frustrated with the purple prose, and aside from very brief moments doesn't seem too concerned with how he comes off in the story once people know it's his story.
This isn't a very good episode anyway, and it's pretty bad as a season premier, but the subject matter and the treatment of it was especially worth discussing I suppose.
Production: 5/10 not too bad but not stand out either
Story: 4/10 it flows alright, but it's missing some beats I feel it needs
Writing: 2.5/5
Characters: 3/5 some interesting stuff with Frasier, but I was more struck by how much more settled Niles seems into the family scenes; and I like Daphne in this one
Relationships: 2/5
Comedy: 2.5/5 maybe a bit generous, but I got a couple really good laughs. The mistaken identity scene though was just painful
Drama: 1.5/5
Personal: 3.5/10
Overall: 23.5/50
Frasier 2x02: The Unkindest Cut of All
This story feels like it began life as a B-plot to a thematically connected story about parents and children that never quite came together, but then got thrown together hastily as a main plot. There are some interesting moments here, but nothing quite works for me. I would say that I like Niles with the puppy, but that good will is minimized by not having more of him in the car scene; I kept expecting him to come back for another embarrassing moment once the conversation became about sons trying to make their father proud, but it never happened.
Production: 6/10 for being so dog heavy it does a pretty good job
Story: 4.5/10 the end result mostly hangs together, but it doesn't seem like a fully finished idea and misses a few opportunities I see in it
Writing: 2/5
Characters: 2.5/5
Relationships: 2.5/5
Comedy: 2.5/5
Drama: 2/5
Personal: 3.5/10
Overall: 25.5/50
Frasier 2x03: The Matchmaker
This is a really good episode, probably not absolute top tier for me, but close. I've been known to note episodes where I get very frustrated by something coming up short of my loving it, and that minor shortfall magnifies what dislike there is for it; this isn't like that, it's slightly short of loving it, but in a good and solid way where I can really like something but not love it.
I don't even mind the misunderstanding/embarrassment humor in this one, it manages to cling to a line that can be very easy to cross. This show actually does a pretty good job playing with that line across the years, so this won't be the last time I get to bring it up.
I do notice myself falling into familiar habits where shipping thoughts give me more to think about than the main plot of a story, but I also feel like the main plot of this almost speaks for itself. While what I noticed tripping me up was Niles. Part of that has to do with the fact that I'm still poking my way through later episodes in between reviews sometimes, so there is a little vertigo coming back to this early point in the development of him and Daphne. I don't know it evened out or it really is that the early scene seemed like the most glaring example. Apparently Frasier hadn't told Niles that he was looking for someone for Daphne, but when it comes out I don't feel there's a lot of compassion for Niles' situation. And rationally there doesn't need to be, at this point absolutely does need to check himself before he wrecks himself, he can't do anything with these feelings for Daphne. And that's a little hard to watch knowing that for this reason and then that one it's going to be a long time before actually can do anything with those feelings.
As I write this, and having trouble feeling like it's making any sense, I've found myself expanding on my previously stated opinion that starting in about s3 we start seeing Niles' feelings more from Niles' perspective instead of Frasier's. It's never been unreasonable to me that Frasier disapproves of the crush especially while Niles is married but I'm working on a notion that Frasier is mostly worried about it being bad for him if Niles messes things up; while later on it becomes more worried for Niles' sake if he screws things up. And like other things, to some extent that makes sense, but as the series progresses and Niles' feelings deepen, they become less a problem Frasier thinks can be solved though discouraging it. So of course later it's treated with more sympathy and compassion, unrequited love just being his cross to bear.
That digression dealt with, is this our first round of the various Cranes being mistaken for gay? Because it won't be the last. It might have happened with Frasier on Cheers I suppose, but I think this was the first time this series leaned into how non-straight the guys seem.
Production: 9/10
Story: 9/10
Writing: 4/5
Characters: 4/5
Relationships: 2.5/5 barring my future inspired thoughts, there's not a ton of relationship work done here; though the opening is cute and there are some pretty good moments
Comedy: 4/5
Drama: 2/5
Personal: 8/10
Overall: 42.5/50 everything's a little shy of exceptional, but it's all good to great
Frasier 2x04: Flour Child
I'm pretty sure in a lot of the rating, this one won't come off great, but I did like it. It's not super funny or all that dramatic, the plot is solid but not properly balanced; I like it but I definitely don't love it; yet I do seem to have a lot of thoughts I need to work through before moving on.
The main problem with this episode is that it's a very Niles-centric episode that refuses to actually focus its time on Niles. Between the Frasier plot and how long the scene in the cab takes there isn't quite enough time for the Niles story. And it only engages with one its central problems by its absence, that being Maris. Niles makes a passing comment early on about how he likes to know what he wants before Maris tells him; and that gets a laugh from the crowd, but it's really not funny. Their marriage is toxic at best, neglectful on average, and is going to get a lot more abusive by the end. This episode gets most of it's humor from Niles being pretty scatter-brained about his flour child, and he's clearly not ready to have a real one, but there is a bigger issue here that's hardly touched on.
Some of my distraction on this subject may be that some of the wording when Niles finally accepts that he isn't ready doesn't quite work. Both saying it's a selfish conclusion and that he thinks the experiment was trying to convince him he was ready when he's not don't track. Sure the initial reason for the experiment was get a basic idea of how difficult parenting is, in a pretty generic way, but at every step he's failed that test. If anything I'd say his subconscious is sabotaging him, signposting that he isn't ready when most intellectual standards would say he could be. The selfish comments seems mostly there to allow Frasier to give a wise response but in character I don't think it works. If this had been brought on by Maris considering adopting a child and Niles concluding that he's not equipped to be a father, you could call that selfish (along with the fact that in this hypothetical Maris probably wanted a child as an accessory); but it's very clear that at this stage having a child would be the selfish (and dangerous) choice in that house.
I also wish this idea didn't seem to come from nowhere and I assume go back to nowhere for several seasons. Niles says that he's been thinking about the possibility of a child for a while, but is it just a biological clock thing or is it something else? Would it be an effort to save his and Maris' marriage (which would again be a selfish choice)? Are we meant to see both this and his attraction to Daphne as part of a mid-life crisis? Is it because he's also attracted to Daphne that he's had some desire for warmth and family stirred in him, and he just hasn't accepted that he'll never have that with Maris? Since this story doesn't really get into the Maris question of whether she wants children, no one asks if Niles wants children enough to leave Maris for someone he could have that kind of life with; I'm sure the answer would be no, especially since he's not ready for children or to leave Maris.
Production: 6/10 I want to go higher but I keep thinking of places where things didn't quite work
Story: 6/10 the structure is just a little too flawed to give it high marks
Writing: 3/5 there are some pretty good jokes, in between some slow moments
Characters: 4/5 there is some good Niles work in here, I just wish it was given more focus
Relationships: 2.5/5 Martin gets some good moments with the boys
Comedy: 3/5
Drama: 2.5/5
Personal: 7/10 I like it but I wish it was better
Overall: 34/50
Frasier 2x05: Duke's, We Hardly Knew Ye
I sort of feel like I should have something to say about this, at the very least the somewhat obvious parallel that had Frasier stayed in Boston he might have ended up spending enough time at Cheers that Freddie might have found himself in a similar situation in a couple decades. But the episode was fine, a little like last season's Christmas ep in highlighting how the leads on this show are the elite rather than the everyman most shows try and make the main characters, to make them appealing to the widest audience. But I don't have fully formed thoughts on any of those points. The episode was fine, and I guess somewhat significant, but it doesn't need much writing about it.
Production: 6.5/10
Story: 7/10
Writing: 2.5/5 Roz and Daphne kind of steal the show when they actually appear
Characters: 2.5/5
Relationships: 2/5
Comedy: 2/5 not a ton of laughs aside from Roz at the beginning
Drama:2 /5
Personal: 6/10
Overall: 30/50
When I was skipping through eps a few weeks ago I watched part of this one, but I don't remember having seen it before that. But this time it definitely stuck in my head, and I was a little trepidatious about actually watching it considering the subject matter.
Truthfully I'm not as hard line as some people about age of consent, in the sense that I tend to think 18 is a little high and still an arbitrary line in the sand that doesn't fit for everyone. So 17 shouldn't necessarily bug me, and considering this would have happened in the late 60s I definitely don't think people were as stuck on 18 as the defining line for such things. I think what bugs me it that the show never even raises the question of if Frasier feels it was acceptable now that he's the older man. Just a few episodes ago we saw him struggle with whether it was appropriate for him to date a 22 year old and that relationship was not presented with any power disparity as a teacher and student could have.
Certainly when he talks about his relationship with Clarice it is with fondness and the romanticism of first love and the past, but when he's uneasy about the book no one even brings up that maybe he isn't completely okay with what happened and is now seeing it through a different light as an adult. It would certainly seem possible to me that, even if he is okay with everything that happened, he might feel uneasy about people knowing about it because it's not going to look good from the outside. And that's why having the episode go to/Niles jumping on the idea that it's about how things ended without ever considering issues with the rest of what happened doesn't feel right to me.
Not that the episode can seem to decide how okay Frasier is with people knowing this is his story. He's angry about not being thanked but then tells Roz not to spread the truth around. Sometimes he seems upset that the story in told in confidence has been used without his consent but sometimes he just seems frustrated with the purple prose, and aside from very brief moments doesn't seem too concerned with how he comes off in the story once people know it's his story.
This isn't a very good episode anyway, and it's pretty bad as a season premier, but the subject matter and the treatment of it was especially worth discussing I suppose.
Production: 5/10 not too bad but not stand out either
Story: 4/10 it flows alright, but it's missing some beats I feel it needs
Writing: 2.5/5
Characters: 3/5 some interesting stuff with Frasier, but I was more struck by how much more settled Niles seems into the family scenes; and I like Daphne in this one
Relationships: 2/5
Comedy: 2.5/5 maybe a bit generous, but I got a couple really good laughs. The mistaken identity scene though was just painful
Drama: 1.5/5
Personal: 3.5/10
Overall: 23.5/50
Frasier 2x02: The Unkindest Cut of All
This story feels like it began life as a B-plot to a thematically connected story about parents and children that never quite came together, but then got thrown together hastily as a main plot. There are some interesting moments here, but nothing quite works for me. I would say that I like Niles with the puppy, but that good will is minimized by not having more of him in the car scene; I kept expecting him to come back for another embarrassing moment once the conversation became about sons trying to make their father proud, but it never happened.
Production: 6/10 for being so dog heavy it does a pretty good job
Story: 4.5/10 the end result mostly hangs together, but it doesn't seem like a fully finished idea and misses a few opportunities I see in it
Writing: 2/5
Characters: 2.5/5
Relationships: 2.5/5
Comedy: 2.5/5
Drama: 2/5
Personal: 3.5/10
Overall: 25.5/50
Frasier 2x03: The Matchmaker
This is a really good episode, probably not absolute top tier for me, but close. I've been known to note episodes where I get very frustrated by something coming up short of my loving it, and that minor shortfall magnifies what dislike there is for it; this isn't like that, it's slightly short of loving it, but in a good and solid way where I can really like something but not love it.
I don't even mind the misunderstanding/embarrassment humor in this one, it manages to cling to a line that can be very easy to cross. This show actually does a pretty good job playing with that line across the years, so this won't be the last time I get to bring it up.
I do notice myself falling into familiar habits where shipping thoughts give me more to think about than the main plot of a story, but I also feel like the main plot of this almost speaks for itself. While what I noticed tripping me up was Niles. Part of that has to do with the fact that I'm still poking my way through later episodes in between reviews sometimes, so there is a little vertigo coming back to this early point in the development of him and Daphne. I don't know it evened out or it really is that the early scene seemed like the most glaring example. Apparently Frasier hadn't told Niles that he was looking for someone for Daphne, but when it comes out I don't feel there's a lot of compassion for Niles' situation. And rationally there doesn't need to be, at this point absolutely does need to check himself before he wrecks himself, he can't do anything with these feelings for Daphne. And that's a little hard to watch knowing that for this reason and then that one it's going to be a long time before actually can do anything with those feelings.
As I write this, and having trouble feeling like it's making any sense, I've found myself expanding on my previously stated opinion that starting in about s3 we start seeing Niles' feelings more from Niles' perspective instead of Frasier's. It's never been unreasonable to me that Frasier disapproves of the crush especially while Niles is married but I'm working on a notion that Frasier is mostly worried about it being bad for him if Niles messes things up; while later on it becomes more worried for Niles' sake if he screws things up. And like other things, to some extent that makes sense, but as the series progresses and Niles' feelings deepen, they become less a problem Frasier thinks can be solved though discouraging it. So of course later it's treated with more sympathy and compassion, unrequited love just being his cross to bear.
That digression dealt with, is this our first round of the various Cranes being mistaken for gay? Because it won't be the last. It might have happened with Frasier on Cheers I suppose, but I think this was the first time this series leaned into how non-straight the guys seem.
Production: 9/10
Story: 9/10
Writing: 4/5
Characters: 4/5
Relationships: 2.5/5 barring my future inspired thoughts, there's not a ton of relationship work done here; though the opening is cute and there are some pretty good moments
Comedy: 4/5
Drama: 2/5
Personal: 8/10
Overall: 42.5/50 everything's a little shy of exceptional, but it's all good to great
Frasier 2x04: Flour Child
I'm pretty sure in a lot of the rating, this one won't come off great, but I did like it. It's not super funny or all that dramatic, the plot is solid but not properly balanced; I like it but I definitely don't love it; yet I do seem to have a lot of thoughts I need to work through before moving on.
The main problem with this episode is that it's a very Niles-centric episode that refuses to actually focus its time on Niles. Between the Frasier plot and how long the scene in the cab takes there isn't quite enough time for the Niles story. And it only engages with one its central problems by its absence, that being Maris. Niles makes a passing comment early on about how he likes to know what he wants before Maris tells him; and that gets a laugh from the crowd, but it's really not funny. Their marriage is toxic at best, neglectful on average, and is going to get a lot more abusive by the end. This episode gets most of it's humor from Niles being pretty scatter-brained about his flour child, and he's clearly not ready to have a real one, but there is a bigger issue here that's hardly touched on.
Some of my distraction on this subject may be that some of the wording when Niles finally accepts that he isn't ready doesn't quite work. Both saying it's a selfish conclusion and that he thinks the experiment was trying to convince him he was ready when he's not don't track. Sure the initial reason for the experiment was get a basic idea of how difficult parenting is, in a pretty generic way, but at every step he's failed that test. If anything I'd say his subconscious is sabotaging him, signposting that he isn't ready when most intellectual standards would say he could be. The selfish comments seems mostly there to allow Frasier to give a wise response but in character I don't think it works. If this had been brought on by Maris considering adopting a child and Niles concluding that he's not equipped to be a father, you could call that selfish (along with the fact that in this hypothetical Maris probably wanted a child as an accessory); but it's very clear that at this stage having a child would be the selfish (and dangerous) choice in that house.
I also wish this idea didn't seem to come from nowhere and I assume go back to nowhere for several seasons. Niles says that he's been thinking about the possibility of a child for a while, but is it just a biological clock thing or is it something else? Would it be an effort to save his and Maris' marriage (which would again be a selfish choice)? Are we meant to see both this and his attraction to Daphne as part of a mid-life crisis? Is it because he's also attracted to Daphne that he's had some desire for warmth and family stirred in him, and he just hasn't accepted that he'll never have that with Maris? Since this story doesn't really get into the Maris question of whether she wants children, no one asks if Niles wants children enough to leave Maris for someone he could have that kind of life with; I'm sure the answer would be no, especially since he's not ready for children or to leave Maris.
Production: 6/10 I want to go higher but I keep thinking of places where things didn't quite work
Story: 6/10 the structure is just a little too flawed to give it high marks
Writing: 3/5 there are some pretty good jokes, in between some slow moments
Characters: 4/5 there is some good Niles work in here, I just wish it was given more focus
Relationships: 2.5/5 Martin gets some good moments with the boys
Comedy: 3/5
Drama: 2.5/5
Personal: 7/10 I like it but I wish it was better
Overall: 34/50
Frasier 2x05: Duke's, We Hardly Knew Ye
I sort of feel like I should have something to say about this, at the very least the somewhat obvious parallel that had Frasier stayed in Boston he might have ended up spending enough time at Cheers that Freddie might have found himself in a similar situation in a couple decades. But the episode was fine, a little like last season's Christmas ep in highlighting how the leads on this show are the elite rather than the everyman most shows try and make the main characters, to make them appealing to the widest audience. But I don't have fully formed thoughts on any of those points. The episode was fine, and I guess somewhat significant, but it doesn't need much writing about it.
Production: 6.5/10
Story: 7/10
Writing: 2.5/5 Roz and Daphne kind of steal the show when they actually appear
Characters: 2.5/5
Relationships: 2/5
Comedy: 2/5 not a ton of laughs aside from Roz at the beginning
Drama:2 /5
Personal: 6/10
Overall: 30/50
